Preview Mode Links will not work in preview mode

Welcome to Pleasure Central Radio!

Part memoir of a modern Renaissance woman, part career advice, part ‘how to be an amazing lover’ instruction manual... 

Pleasure Central is definitely about sexAND... Pleasure Central is just as much about every other kind of pleasure.

 (Support the podcast and be an integral part of the conversation by becoming a Patron at


Mar 22, 2020



Embodiment geeks Suzanne & Rebecca talking about the effects of isolation due to the Corona virus/COVID-19 Shelter in Place mandates, the age of technology and it's effects on humans and how to mitigate those effects.


Would you like to help us make this podcast even better? Tell us what really helped you, what hit home, what surprised you, what motivated you to do something different in your own life...

And thank you for being a part of the conversation!

-Radiant Rebecca



042 - Embodiment In The Age Of Isolation & Technological, With Suzanne & Rebecca

Corona virus/COVID-19 Isolation strategies

2020, Radiant Rebecca
Pleasure Central Radio

Talking about the effects of isolation due to the Corona virus/COVID-19 Shelter in Place mandates, the age of technology and it's effects on humans and how to mitigate those effects.

Edit TranscriptStop Play-on-click
Save EditorExport HTMLExport PDFExport WebVTT>


[0:25]Well, hello Suzanne, welcome back to Pleasure Central radio.
Suzanne: Hi Rebecca so good to be with you again 
Rebecca: we have some really interesting things to talk about today don't we 
Suzanne: I think so,
Rebecca: Where do you want to start?
Suzanne: well to me with the pandemic the global pandemic my work has shifted a lot of people in my kind of profession have shifted to much more work online so I have
become really excited and interested in how embodiment and Technology are working with each other and dancing with each other and how we as very embodied ladies, I might say, work with those nuances. 

[1:14] Rebecca: I'm glad that you bring that up because it's been really interesting for me watching a lot of my friends suddenly trying to get used to working from home,
because I've been an entrepreneur for 15 years and I've worked from home on and off in small and large chunks during that time and
watching people trying to get used to that and to adjust to the different ways of being social and different ways of being at home -- suddenly home is just not the place where you relax you have to work there too and how do you balance,
working and doing your laundry and eating and then not working when you're not supposed to be working. It's been interesting.
Suzanne: Well I'm noticing the amount of rituals like daily rituals are increasing. So for example my partner and I
do have been doing yoga pretty much every day and
After the first day I said honey yoga includes making the bed so the whole beginning of yoga would actually be us making the bed
and preparing the whole house for the next thing so it's almost like one ritual would feed another one.

[2:38] And that would enhance the sense of these juicy compartments.
They are really only existing through the realm of the mind and behavior if you're in one space for a longer period of time than you're used to be.
Rebecca: I love that you call those rituals. It's interesting being in the high performance work that I've been in for so long I've always thought of that as habit stacking.
Ritual sounds like a much nicer way of wrapping that into your day, you know. It feels like a much more feminine and inclusive way and I like that you're talking about you and your partner doing things these things together because it does seem like it's bringing family life to a more focused and more present in most people's environments. If they have family - if they live alone like me, well, then it's a completely different story.
Suzanne: Yeah I am interested I am interested in your experience actually "living alone" because I'm interested in how you're navigating that. I have noticed that like simple things like
after two days-- we're talking about being on the 4th Day, by the way, of when the mayor of San Francisco issued a shelter in place decree... and...
The first two days my partner had his desk facing away.
And now he yes last night he turned his desk towards so he could see me moving through the space. Not to interact with me but to see.
Moving around. Like just that alone I think has a pretty big impact on
kind of his psyche and my psyche and this awareness of interrelationship even though we are trying our best to maintain some semblance's of privacy and individuality.

[4:42] Rebecca: That's interesting that you say that because in feng shui one of the recommended things for where you place your desk you don't ever want anybody to be at your back.

[4:53] Don't want doors to be able to open and you not to be able to see who's there so the fact that he's turned his desk around so that he can see you I imagine probably has some psychological & physiological benefit too,
Suzanne: I totally I'm also sensing that what's happened in my home as well is,
any home project that was slightly bothering me now is being attended to so it becomes very clear you know we talked about thankful finish way or,
different ways of organizing the home so that the mind can rest there. it's much more apparent so you know, we talked about technology...
We're talking about you know... I mean, an apartment is a kind of Technology we didn't always have you know these these structures that would hold us for long periods of time in one place human species District much from nomadic and have homes that could be taken apart reassembled and so it's really interesting in this time also to be feeling,
how we have these structures that are holding us in place,
but then we have the internet simultaneously that is connecting us across the entire world and that's not a thing that's not like a mental construct, that's something that I feel.

[6:15] You know when I'm online I can actually feel that in my body, this larger span of connection.

[6:23] Rebecca: That is pretty interesting so,
I don't remember if I mentioned but I have just been on a trip, kind of a reunion with a bunch of my friends and met a bunch of new friends too and its a global thing so I have friends from all over the world and met new friends from all over the world
and now coming back and having all these shelter-in-place ordinances all over, more and more people are connecting by phone instead of just by Facebook.
Which is really neat. it's really lovely for me. Pou'd asked about my experience as a single person working from home. it's not that different from my normal with a couple of exceptions I'm seeing less people coming to coach with me here but even more,

[7:10] a lot of my friends who normally would be at work all day long and I wouldn't even think about contacting they wouldn't think about me
now they're working from home and they're trying to figure out how to adjust so they're wanting to connect they wanting to have zoom calls or have phone calls or you know, just just have some time with another human connection
and that has been really lovely I think that's been probably the best thing about this for me is I'm getting more connection from people who I normally wouldn't.

Suzanne: what do you feel you know right now we are you have these various luxuries you have a beautiful recording studio, we have computers, we have zoom. I've always experienced you while living in the same town as you and was able to see you in person as someone that would feel and register the world through the body,
even though you have a lot of intellect. And I'm curious about
how you- how we have these technological advances that allow us to connect but then also embodiment practices that help us feel and sometimes those used to feel antithetical,
but they do two different things that can actually distract each other and now.
I'm curious about how you as someone who is...
[8:33] ...You know what I would see as deeply in the body how you seen this deeper dependence on technology.

[8:44] Rebecca: What an interesting question I feel like in some ways that technology versus embodiment is a false dichotomy.

[8:59] Technology is more of an advancement of embodiment.
Then and yes certainly some people will sit in front of technology and use it as an excuse to leave their body but I don't think that's necessary. I don't think that's a requirement and as somebody who's worked from home and with my computer for many many years, maybe I've just figured out how to adjust but I don't think that's it. I think it's more like you still have to be paying attention to your body you still have to get up and move when you feel tightness showing up you still want to be able to find positions that are comfortable for you and maybe that's part of my secret is that I do tend to move around a lot sometimes I'll have my laptop on my lap while I'm laying on the couch and kind of propped up so I have good posture, sometimes I'll be sitting in front of my desk because I'll be editing something and I really want to have the big screen and the touch pad. Sometimes I'll be downstairs in a dark room where I'm just sitting there and brainstorming and paying attention so recognizing that technology doesn't have to suck you in and make you hunched over and just forget about everything in your physicalness.
I think that's an important piece of it. And then setting up your space for that.
Suzanne: Right I mean I feel the example the other day I was finished a woman's group we had to finish it online.

[10:27] And I was uploading the zoom call on to a private Channel on YouTube and I was so excited about it that I noticed my body was slumped over more and I noticed I was turning to ignore the cues of my body to get up because I so want to complete the project and this is something I've noticed as a body worker for years, that people will override the desire to get up because I want to finish a project.

[11:03] But at the same time I don't know how different that is than setting your timer to sit in meditation,
for an hour and having various physical tensions come up while you're sitting and meditating in your body.
I think that is a little different because while you're sitting and meditating,
there's an awareness of attention and when you're focused on a project and you're trying to get a project done there's usually not an awareness of the tension there's an awareness of trying, you know of striving. The way that I've worked with that my high performance coach is actually giving giving me some tips and one of them is I have a timer that has it's just a cube and I can turn the cube in any direction and whatever.
On top of the cube when you set it down that's how.
[11:57] So I have a 45-minute timer on that and I will set the 45 minute timer on my counter or someplace where I can't reach it,
and then I'll go and I'll sit and do all my work. and it's a really obnoxious timer so I don't want to let it go once it starts going off. I have to get up move over and turn it off and then once I'm up I'm usually like okay,
I do need a short break, run downstairs, go to the bathroom get a good drink or something like that so it helps me have this rhythm of moving and in my experience, even when I really really want to finish a project, that feeling of really wanting to finish it, still means it's going to take 20 minutes or 30 minutes to finish so unless I'm truly at the last click,
the last web page, the last upload, I just remind myself, "yeah, just keep going don't worry you'll come back to in just a second and when I do come back to it a more refreshed I have more oxygen in my system my brain is working better my eyes are working better" and that sort of reinforcement of knowing that that's going to happen means that I don't put it off as long as I would have normally. it's a little bit of a life hack.
A little bit of a strategy I've set up for myself. 
Suzanne: but it it brings me to the use of tools like the cube.
Software on the phone I have the aura ring now that records your sleep.

[13:27] And the phases of sleep which is like it almost an extra sensory tool.
Write an addition to a human body that.
It's been interesting to to imagine you working with that timer because it's still not an attention to your body in the moment it is using a device outside.

[13:57] Can forget the body and then come back to the body except it develops attention to the body this is this is the interesting Nuance yeah so,
in my experience with the timer I don't use the timer every time I sit down and he more I also have had this,
it's called the upright go it's something that you you did okay yeah I was that it's very neat so it's a little device that you put on your shoulders and
you calibrate yourself to whatever is up right for you and thanks to my Pilates experience with you I have a good idea of what actually is a break for me having that nice arch in my spine the balance starch
and then it will track your hunching over and everything so the thing about that and about a lot of this biofeedback,
is that you use it on a regular basis at first and then it tapers off because at some point you and your body developed this awareness.
Hey this is how it's supposed to feel and when you're not doing that you feel awkward so once your body is trained to the point of this is what up play
upright feels like while I'm editing this is what I prayed feels like well I'm doing this over here this is what upgrade feels like all I'm doing dishes then,
you don't have that need to to have the outside feedback anymore because you've developed the feedback inside.
This is.

[15:25] This is so great.

[15:26] So great that you articulated it because that has been a very similar experience that I've had as well like.
When I use this ring I was at first so shocked about how little REM sleep I was
and then I realized you know after I started changing some of my sleeping habits I could feel when I was getting better REM sleep,
and other so when I first went to the.

[15:54] Transformational.

[15:54] Informational technology conference with my partner three years ago I met a man who was making a very cool device called The Leaf.
Clean called the leaf and it was a heart rate monitor heart rate sensor and what it would do is if,
your heart rate variability got to into a interval that would integrate that you were anxious it would Buzz,
and it was one of the.

[16:24] The experiences I've had.

[16:25] Because it actually felt like it helped regulate the nervous system if it was very it created a lot of.
Calmness in the body because you are aware right away of how to bring attention back to your breath and calm yourself down.
But I studied I said to him you know is this going to create a dependence and he looked at me he's like no this is a temporary tattoo.
This is a removable and I wasn't sure until now wearing the ring that I have.
Yes I can feel that I can feel the truth in that.
Yeah and I related to very similar when you and I were working in Pilates together you would give me body cues and you say oh yeah okay now you've got it and I would be able to feel in my body when,
you were affirming that I had figured it out so I could feel that difference but until I had the.
The q's and your feedback really.

[17:24] From the visual experience of my body.

[17:27] Body I didn't really know where I was supposed to go but once I knew that I was able to do it on my own repeat it,
I could do doming on myself in front of my mirror but I had to have that feedback first feedback as a learning tool an awareness to.
And you know I am really curious about your thoughts about all of the touch professionals in this.

[17:53] Particular time of an undetermined.

[17:56] And amount of time of very reduced touching touch professionals but also humans are mammals and we're touching lasts and.
You know what what do you feel will be the,
the support to people trying to get their touch needs not.
It's kind of like a jump but you know I felt I felt you make this really incredible bridge between you know the technology and the body and then how another person helps a person come into a body and then I said oh wow that's really changing now,
yeah it is and I think it's worth noting that.
People who live alone like me or just people that are not getting very much touch I think a lot of adult men in our society have had this problem for a long time and it's not really been noticed
is if you're an adult man and you're not in some kind of relationship how often do you get touched by a.
Mmm it's very rare and it's kind of awkward especially when you realize that.
Everybody needs touch they have done studies about babies if babies aren't touched and held they grow up differently they have different,
personality problems they have different effects they just don't seem to be as healthy and just being touched just being held is incredibly healing so I think.
This was my biggest.

[19:25] Learning about the shelter in place I shall isolation is that the people that live alone and don't have anybody to be touching and connecting with are going to find it to be even harder than normal especially in a mountain mental health reasons.
Going to mental health level and having been through some of that myself I feel like I've developed enough strategies to know how I can help and one of them is just being outside and getting a lot of oxygen that helps.

[19:55] Even when you're not being.

[19:55] In touch but also I think that there's a reasonable.

[20:04] I got to be careful what I say here right I think that this is a good reason to find some way of having some touch in your life one way or another you still are going to have to mitigate risk however you see fit.
Going without touch for an indeterminate period of time not really an option.
Remembering to one of the reasons I became a Pilates teacher was I felt like it was the best solution I could find.

[20:39] To working with the mind for my for me I was a psycho as I was a Psychology major I wanted to be a psychotherapist but actually I found more peace in in moving the.
Not just moving the body it was moving the body with an integration of thought and how the mind was used but then later on,
I think around the time I met you and Seattle there was a deepening of that process when,
it wasn't just about focusing the mind and the body and tried to control the body it was a self responsibility that every single cell in the body I could attend to.

[21:23] Awareness through visualization,
but also through sensation and UCSF I met a had done some studies and met a professor.
Who would help with this research on the insular cortex of the insular cortex they found along the it on the late 90s,
is a part of the brain that's responsible for self referencing and self referencing is crucial for human being able to feel autonomy but also interestingly in the flip side empathy.
And one of the things that mind-body exercise does is it increases the amount of energy that goes to that part of the brain.

[22:10] So it's interesting in a time of less touch I think mind body movement will actually be a opportunity and a place for people to feel more.
Supported by themselves by their own system.
And maybe a crucial supplement and a complement to other needs that we have as humans.
So I love that you brought up self-referencing being the key to empathy because for me that.
That makes so much sense being able to identify my own.

[22:57] My own space it's more like my the things that I'm responsible for.
Which is my energy my thoughts my body my feelings my connection that stuff and separate it from other people's when I get it mixed up with other people's,
I don't do it very often but I think we all do sometimes especially in times of stress someone might be freaking out and.

[23:21] Like oh gosh I have.

[23:22] Have to freak out too because they're freaking out and then we realized I know it's okay I can I can be in my own space and have empathy for them but not have to go into that,
Panic with them,
and that's something that's been coming in really handy in the world recently with people having all kinds of responses to what's going on.
Yeah I think that's one of the most important things and we talked about this and the last podcast we did too.

[23:53] Together but I think it's worth.

[23:55] Repeating that another really curious thing about the human.
Human mammal is that we are actually less immune and less able to detect places in the environment where we're safe,
when we're afraid so it's a really interesting time to somehow.
A sense of safety and peace amid an environment that doesn't seem safer peaceful it's an interesting Paradox and you know actually.

[24:38] I was talking with some friends about this recently and the fact that I've been polyamorous for 20 years and have had to think about safety and,
fluid exchange and what that means and what the risks are and know all about that in order to feel safe and comfortable in the relationships that I men I have to know all that that my partners have to know about that we have to agree on certain things and,
that takes a lot of work and a lot of effort and often times people that aren't Polly will ask me,
how do you deal with that sounds so stressful and it really it isn't it's about education and about making choices.
Risk and deciding how much risk you're willing to take and how much risk you're not willing to take and then,
to communicate your boundaries so it's it's not easy but it is simple and,
I think my experience of doing that for 20 years has given me a leg up in this environment where,
the general public is realizing they have to start thinking about this stuff too and talking about it and communicating and figuring out how they can live with risk and what kind of risk and how much risk they are willing to live with.

[25:50] I mean that's so well put I've noticed the other day I went for a walk with a friend and we walked 10 feet apart in nature,
and we did it intentionally for a reason I wanted to see.
If this is possibly what we may need to do for some time what it would feel like how close could we feel without getting close.
I noticed that when people want to connect with me and asked if I want to hang out I have to actually assess.
In my body and a case-by-case basis,
what feels appropriate relative to myself and relative to the environment that I meant relative to the what's happening culturally and politically and socially and so,
I think the one of the.
And benefits that we could experience in this time there's a potential is that an increase of self-evaluation,
if fear isn't a part of it if fear is somehow for if we're not doing these things because we were afraid but we're doing these things because we're discriminating.
Given potential to cultivate more intuition.

[27:15] Yeah and you mean discriminating as in paying attention and being aware of what is important to you not discriminating as and saying you know.
Discriminating against Racers isn't it funny how that can be used that is that is true yeah well I'm glad you pointed that out because yeah I'll maybe not discriminating you can use discriminating but that usually has Discerning is a better,
but discrimination.
Is that necessarily a bad context it does that does not sure no I think it's just discrimination now has that.

[27:52] That the near of racial.

[27:54] Or something it has a negative connotation in our culture now but Discerning I think is a much better and more accurate word for this
I can I read you the I had to just look up,
so everyone knows what the definition is discrimination can be the number one definition is unjust or prejudicial treatment.
Which is interesting but then the second is recognition and understanding,
of the difference between one thing and another yeah so it is both when you were right the the first way of using it as the way most people most people may associate with it.

[28:36] And I felt one other thing I wanted to say Discerning right yeah so if discernment is a thing that we cultivate,
people following their guts right interesting because.
With Corona virus people talk a lot about drinking more water because as soon as you drink more you can flush the virus down into your gut and it's killed in your gut right,
and the gut following gut instinct following intuition is something that each person has to cultivate relative,
their understanding of their own body as just a really interesting thing how the virus can be digested in the gut but simultaneously house,
use like knowing how to follow your gut is the is another way that we are going to become healthy,
like having a good microbiome is actually one of the most important things for immunity so just kind of an interesting like.
Interface between those two yeah I'd agree.

[29:47] And I love the kissing parallel not quite I love that she would say.
To feel in your body and discern for each situation for each person for each moment how you want to interact and what feels most comfortable for you.
Because I think that really is the key and when we,
learn how our intuition talks to us I don't think everybody has that gut feeling I think everybody has some way of listening to their intuition but it doesn't always feel the same to other people but once you learn how your body is talking to.
And what it's saying and how to learn how to trust that then following that.
Is an important key to being able to move throughout the world and feel comfortable and feel safe.
I would that brings me to is something that some of you may resonate with but that in this current environment also I'm curious.
Have you ever noticed the feeling of fear that doesn't feel like yours.

[30:57] Like it feels like it's in the air but it doesn't quite feel like it's in your body.
Yeah that's fair yeah yes I've been really curious about this because I would one of the things also I think that's worth can were thinking about as in terms of embodiment is,
because Durant interdependent species you know humans depend for mammals we depend on each other I think,
we will feel each other and feel the tone of a collective like an expression of a body you know,
but it won't actually be personal sometimes,
and to be able to distinguish what is a personal experience from what is a collective experience is also an embodiment practice I think you're right I had an experience recently so I was flying through the Fort Lauderdale Airport,
and it happened to be the day that paranoia was starting to really hit people were trying to get home they had just come one day cruises it was before then but yeah.
The atmosphere in the airport was pretty crazy I wouldn't say it was high-level panic but it was medium to medium high level Panic with a large majority of people however.

[32:22] Being who I am and having come from where I had just come from there just come off and Abraham picks Cruz lots of time in the warm water
everybody on our ship was happy and healthy so I know there was no worry within me and so I'm moving through this air.
And I'm observing what's going on and just kind of.
Appreciating you know okay people are where they are and that's cool and I'm going to do what I want to do I'm going to be over here and do this and chat on the phone with some friends.

[32:50] Chat on the phone with some friends I ended up.

[32:52] Getting the line at Starbucks and there was this person in front of me.
Who was talking really calmly and just really appreciating her cruise and sharing how the you know the first couple of days they were a little bit nervous but then after that I relaxed and everything felt super safe I felt like the boat was
but really taking care of them the staff was great and they were not worried at all the rest of their vacation was amazing and I ended up asking her what ship she was on,
out of curiosity because she had such a.

[33:20] Calm.

[33:21] To be on the same ship as I was and she wasn't part of the Abraham group.
We had enough of a calm Vibe between the two of us that in this sea of near Panic we were able to find each other and have this lovely lovely conversation because we weren't participating in it it was around us but it wasn't,
in US I felt that I could feel chills as you were describing that right how you were able to.
Because you felt safe yeah.

[33:57] And one of the most interesting contemplations of this time.
I spent my afternoon yesterday with one of my movement teachers whose a Continuum movement teacher and the most important part about Continuum movement,
I finally learned yesterday which I've spent three years with this woman almost 3 years with her.
And she said that there wasn't she didn't,
she wasn't afraid and I didn't really quite understand why she wasn't afraid and then I did a little deeper Research into the fundamental,
origins of Continuum and the most important part is that every movement that one does in this movement form is done with curiosity.
And I remember.
I was just starting to teach Pilates that I was kept thinking about this word curiosity but that would be probably the most important word.
To cultivate in a practice of moving and it felt like,
perhaps that being curious about what's going to happen in our environment.
And being curious about what's going to happen through my day as I'm working on my computer.

[35:23] Is actually one of the most crucial ways of becoming inside a body because it's very hard to be fearful and curious at the same time,
I think it's impossible actually yeah just try doing it was I couldn't do it I think it's one or the other and I'm glad that you brought that up because curiosity is something that some of my teachers talk about as well,
I think it Kelly LaRue is the one I've heard it from the most but if you have an attitude of cure,
it's almost impossible to be afraid and if you have an attitude of curiosity it means that whatever you're looking at you're more likely to be seeing it as an adventure than something that you're.

[36:17] This helps me a lot a couple of years ago I had when I was getting divorced.

[36:20] Getting divorced and didn't know where I was.

[36:21] I was going to be living or what I was going to be doing or what my work was going to be one of my Abe friends said well you can look at this as something really scary or you can look at it as an adventure and it's up to you.
And that completely changed the way that I was approaching it so yeah I recommend it.
Feels it was just about a perfect place to take a pause what do you think yeah.

[36:53] Miss reveling in this in this curiosity because I feel like I actually came into this podcast today in,
like a question like how am I going to sell my computer all day,
and actually feel like I'm in my body and now that we brought up curiosity and really started marinating in it I'm like I can feel the cells,
like I can feel this tingling under the surface of my skin I feel this aliveness and it feels like this almost like taking a first breath.
Course if I'm actually curious while I'm interacting,
with my environment whether it's a computer or phone if that curiosity is,
inside of my body and not just outside my body if it's both places if I'm toggling between being curious about you looking at your beautiful face through this zoom and then I'm feeling into my body and curious about that I feel like I'm
this kind of river of experience and change that actually doesn't end and.

[37:59] That feels very life-giving that's beautiful mmm.
And actually I love that you're bringing it up that way what how can I be curious about this how much curiosity can I Infuse in my day especially because as you're saying that I'm realizing,
we can see technology as this thing that sucks Us in and takes us out of our body or we could see it as a bionic,
Improvement to the senses we already have right and I bionic Improvement and not,
an end because you know these devices when the devices we use externally improve and that just that takes another human curious about how to Improvement I love that we have people that.
In our work environment.

[38:51] Our work environment you know are.

[38:55] In charge of user experiences they look at how does a human experience this thing in a better way and there are ways that people who create technology try to get humans obsessed and addicted and that's an interesting thing I think as a human to try to distinguish,
when you have an obsession with your losing contact,
with your physical experience or when you're in contact with a technology with you can that will pull yourself away.
And still find the inhabiting of your Selma the inhabiting of your flesh your own movement your own connection to a tree.
As engaging as rich,
and maybe that's the mark that we engage it at can I actually be as engaged in my computer as I am with a book if I cannot if I can't toggle between those two things I may be less adaptable and these time.

[39:54] But you can you can toggle now that you know it'll be easier exactly yeah what an exciting life,
educating the fear out of our bodies I love it well thank you very much for this conversation this is from lovely
thank you so much darling always ever done there like to.